Steel Division 2 Brings Single Player Strategic map campaign similar to totalwar

[Destraex]

Just because you can fire out to 2km does not mean you can hit let alone penetrate at those ranges. That is the trick. If a valentine took out a panther i would expect it to be at very short range. Check out the is2 tanks accuracy. Its actually very bad at hitting anything at most ranges. I doubt a Valentine could take out a Panther even at point blank frontally. But it's possible I reckon from the side.

All I have to say is that even at rifles will pen panthers in real life through the sides iirc. That is the reason for the side skirts.

How did the Panther die? Did it get penetrated or did they bail out? Wondering if spalling was the issue.

From memory in SD44, for every 100m you added 1 AP point of penetration. For SD2 I will have to look it up.
Also in SD44 their were only really two tank ranges. If I recall the common one was 1000m and the uncommon range on something like a panther was 1200m. I was a bit confused when I saw 2000m as the standard tank range in SD2, but unlike normandy the open areas are huge and I guess most tanks could fire 2000m, hell most machine guns could with the correct sites. The only problem being optical ability.



You would have to mod steel division if you wanted combat mission like stats. But in general it's very good for the kind of game it is.

It will go something like this:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Steel_Division/comments/6ak9j9/veterancy_and_accuracy_calculations_explained/

https://www.reddit.com/r/Steel_Division/comments/6bjnnn/math_division_normandy_44penetration_bounce_and/

[AchillesLastStand]

The panther was penned, wasn't paying to close attention as was watching somewhere else at the time.
Another thing being discussed is how tank killers are pretty much worthless due to their poor recon abilities, if they don't get off the 1st shot which often times happen they are dead meat. I don't see Eugen changing the 2000 range thingy but some balancing is needed.

Some of the new stuff added today looks good, especially that last new map on the list is massive. Nice sized urban areas.

[AchillesLastStand]

Played a bit in the beta a bit and the Back to War pack plus 4 new maps is getting patched in tomorrow.
One thing that is baffling me is why Eugen decided to give tanks{all} a universal range of 2000m. Been playing mostly against AI and the Soviet side does seem a bit OP atm. Just tonight I had a Valentine and a T-70 take out a Panther/Tiger which is a load of #*&%.  Back to the range subject there are variances in the stats such as penetration/damage/suppress/blast/accuracy to make up for the universal range of 2000, still is confusing as to why they did this. Not sure out of laziness or some other reason/s. In real life no way would a T70 or T34 stand a chance against a Tiger/Panther/Nashorn.

Don't like the sound of this :(

Don't get me wrong I have had fun, don't think this is a deal breaker but does takes a lil getting used to.

[Destraex]

The panther was penned, wasn't paying to close attention as was watching somewhere else at the time.
Another thing being discussed is how tank killers are pretty much worthless due to their poor recon abilities, if they don't get off the 1st shot which often times happen they are dead meat. I don't see Eugen changing the 2000 range thingy but some balancing is needed.

Some of the new stuff added today looks good, especially that last new map on the list is massive. Nice sized urban areas.

Interesting that tank killers should have poor spotting. I did not particulary notice in sd44 as i always used recon units anyways. Game uses borg spotting which is unfortunate.

[Skoop]

Downloading, finally get to check out the SP campaign.

[Jarhead0331]

Downloading, finally get to check out the SP campaign.

The campaign looks delicious. Unfortunately, won't be able to try it until tomorrow night.  :-[

[SirAndrewD]

The campaign looks delicious. Unfortunately, won't be able to try it until tomorrow night.  :-[

Nay, it's scrumptious.  Delectable even.  A true feast!

[Jarhead0331]

The campaign looks delicious. Unfortunately, won't be able to try it until tomorrow night.  :-[

Nay, it's scrumptious.  Delectable even.  A true feast!

Sounds like its a smorgasbord of eastern front warfare. Can't wait to dig in. 

[SirAndrewD]

Well, I took off a little bite (ok, ending the food puns).   I really liked how it played out thus far.  The campaign map has a lot going on and I'm liking the system of mixing AI and human control for friendlies.  Had a feel like an easier to understand version of the Graviteam games.  I'll give it a bit more play later.

[SirAndrewD]

Second opinion is really really great. 

Really, I didn't expect the campaign map to be so...crunchy.   It's rules deep and I love the movement point system and shifting front line.

You have considerations to make on support, air coverage, maintaining lines of supply ect.   Encirclement matters and so far it seems like the AI does a good job of managing its front and not doing anything idiotic.

I'll be honest, I didn't quite know what i was doing on my first try and got my butt handed to me.  The tactical battles work a little differently in how deployments are handled than in the skirmish mode, so I totally botched my first go. 

What I love is that the campaign forces you to drop the metagame of the skirmish, which I felt sometimes relied too heavily on deck building and not enough on just working with what you have in the field.  The combat phase system is preserved, but their translation of it to the Campaign tactical system is elegant, having certain formations given a phase rating based on their nature and speed of reaching the front.   

I almost liken it to the phase system in Operational Art of War, but with a tighter focus and tactical fighting. 

I'm going to really dig into this one tonight and try to spread Stalin's love all over the Fascist invaders of the Rodina.  I figure trying with the side with the all the advantages will give me a touch of a handicap, although the Germans do get to dig in and fight with fortifications. 

Lots of potential in this one.

[Skoop]

^ I agree, campaign is really fun.  You have to pay attention to which battlegroups you have positioned on the map and leaving enough points to support each other in the opponents turn.  The phase system plays a role in when you can commit reserves. 

I was having a hard time at the beginning trying to control everything and was getting worked by the AI.  I finally set it up so that every battle I have at least 2 battlegroups attacking in the A phase or 3 BGs if possible and delegated the other 2 BGs to the AI. 


Once I did that, it was far more enjoyable.


There's some crafty maneuvering on the strategy map that allows you to set up some great lopsided battles.  You can envelope and isolate units like the tip of a spearhead then go in to the tactical battle and annihilate them.   

[SirAndrewD]

^Exactly, this is really the beauty of what this game does right. 

As I say, it reminds me of planning a battle in Operational Art of War IV, and that's nuts that it's that deep in a "RTS".

Getting down the art of planning how the phases are going to work in an assault is key, and I haven't 100% done it yet. 

Also the idea, again one that Art of War did well, of understanding movement vs Tempo, is key.   You can move and set up a good attack, but delay it a turn to get the best results, but, will it cost you the precious time to achieve the objective?

I really expected a Risk style bare bones system here.  The Wargame series didn't really set me up to expect a ton more.   

Instead, they'v really leveled up their game and made something very deep and worse the price of admission. 

I can honestly see this system having a ton of crossover potential for a lot of 20th Century warfare.

[Skoop]

It would be awesome if the devs added the ability to play the campaign in coop.  The mechanic is already there, when your setting up the tactical battle and deciding which battle groups you control and which ones assigned to the AI.  Instead of assigning to AI you could assign them to other human players.  That would truly make it a masterpiece.

[mbar]

No tutorial other than diving right in it seems. I guess '44 was the tutorial.

[acctingman]

I read somewhere that SD2 has a "difficulty" slider in the campaign game. Can someone who's playing it confirm this? I'm still struggling with SD1 and I know there isn't one there and while I'm getting better, I lose more than I win  :P