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Stellaris

Started by RedArgo, October 01, 2015, 01:58:22 PM

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bob48

I noticed that you have been playing it a lot just recently.
'We few, we happy few, we band of brothers'

'Clip those corners'

Recombobulate the discombobulators!

Martok

#1081
Quote from: undercovergeek on November 28, 2017, 09:15:44 AM
Dwarves are coming to stellaris - and if they don't have a mining bonus I'll be making an official complaint
Looks like elves and orcs are getting in on the party as well.  Part of me wants to roll my eyes, part of me can't wait to try them out!  :-[  Mostly, though, I'm interested in the Humanoids DLC for the new music and voicework. 



Quote from: bob48 on November 28, 2017, 09:19:03 AM
I noticed that you have been playing it a lot just recently.
There's a reason for that.  ;)  I know Paradox games aren't your thing, but Stellaris is really something else. 
"Like we need an excuse to drink to anything..." - Banzai_Cat
"I like to think of it not as an excuse but more like Pavlovian Response." - Sir Slash

"At our ages, they all look like jailbait." - mirth

"If we had lines here that would have crossed all of them. For the 1,077,986th time." - Gusington

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ghostryder

Elves of stellaris is really well done. The shipsets and stations are great- and the variety of elf races.....like Drow...etc  with their own starting system is well done. There's even a nude patch...not on the workshop but i have the link to it if your interested---as the modder really mods on the adult site--which has adult mods for CK2 and stellaris.

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=915432220

undercovergeek

With orcs and dwarf sets I can see a demand for a lot of 40k mods

GR - no one wants nude mods for the game, there's pornhub with 'real' people for that

ghostryder

I don't know. ever since morrowind and better bodies they are the most downloaded. Heck, all mods in morrowind use better bodies as a base.  O0

Kushan

PanzersEast: Have to think to myself.... will I play the first one by the Winter Sale?  Probably not, then I should remove Dragonfall
PanzersEast: but that is thinking too logically.... and Steam Sales are about ignoring Logic

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HoodedHorseJoe

Generally happy with what I read, two things that I'm worried about but willing to give the benefit of the doubt:

* The mis-matched power bonus to the weaker side... I don't know. Seems a bit too artificial and gamey for the sake of a balance that may not even be needed.

* While I'm all for fleet limits, I worry that without a Fleet-per-System limit as well, we might just get a stack-by-proxy setup. It really depends what the incentives are to spread your fleets out because if they're not there you're going to want to keep your fleets together in case they keep THEIR fleet together.

But yeah, I'm generally positive about Stellaris.
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ghostryder

My main problem with this is the assumption of doomstacks being a bad thing. This was taughted in Civ games forever--so along came hexes and stack limits---or one unit per hex, to win then you had to combine arms. Sounds good on paper---but the end reality was the A.I. can't combine arms. Therefore any win you could ever hope for by the A.I. was via an abstract victory condition where the A.I. can be buffed to cheat a win. like a Science victory. but turn down win options to just conquest and suddenly there's no reason to play a civ game because the game cannot put forth a challenge. The other option is to allow the other victory conditions so the A.I. can cheat to a win--but even that boils down to a boring singular tech race then.

as bad as people think Doom stacks are--you have to go back to Civ4 and it's doom stacks to actually enjoy a single player game where the A.I. can challenge you. And concidering the fact Paradox is generally even worse than Faraxis when it comes to A.I. I fear Stellaris is going to be doomed to the same fate Civ5 and Civ 6 suffered. a strategy game that cannot offer up a decent single player experience.

Doom stacks also make late game crisis's much more challenging. are we to believe Paradox is going to incorporate an A.I. that will manage fleets in a way these changes indicate? It can't even get Sector vassals to correctly build things after how many DLC and patches? These changes require an A.I. on a level we will never see---it'll be like the HOI3 release but worse.

undercovergeek

Quote from: bob48 on November 28, 2017, 09:19:03 AM
I noticed that you have been playing it a lot just recently.

I've been trying the one planet challenge but without much success - my fault not the games so am trying a few tall planets then I'll go back to the one

solops

Quote from: ghostryder on November 30, 2017, 02:38:20 PM
My main problem with this is the assumption of doomstacks being a bad thing. This was taughted in Civ games forever--so along came hexes and stack limits---or one unit per hex, to win then you had to combine arms. Sounds good on paper---but the end reality was the A.I. can't combine arms. Therefore any win you could ever hope for by the A.I. was via an abstract victory condition where the A.I. can be buffed to cheat a win. like a Science victory. but turn down win options to just conquest and suddenly there's no reason to play a civ game because the game cannot put forth a challenge. The other option is to allow the other victory conditions so the A.I. can cheat to a win--but even that boils down to a boring singular tech race then.

as bad as people think Doom stacks are--you have to go back to Civ4 and it's doom stacks to actually enjoy a single player game where the A.I. can challenge you. And concidering the fact Paradox is generally even worse than Faraxis when it comes to A.I. I fear Stellaris is going to be doomed to the same fate Civ5 and Civ 6 suffered. a strategy game that cannot offer up a decent single player experience.

Doom stacks also make late game crisis's much more challenging. are we to believe Paradox is going to incorporate an A.I. that will manage fleets in a way these changes indicate? It can't even get Sector vassals to correctly build things after how many DLC and patches? These changes require an A.I. on a level we will never see---it'll be like the HOI3 release but worse.

Well said. I agree. I doubt if I will update Stellaris any more. I think it's current defective state is far superior to the game after the planned 2.0 changes.
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ghostryder

Speaking of updates a minor one released with the human DLC-- not a lot in the update itself and should not effect save games. I bought the DLC. It's basically Orcs, dwarves, what could be gnomes or hobbits, and a cyclopes. It doesn't compare to the Elves of Stellaris mod mentioned above---which included 4 great ship sets, several elf races along with 9 animated phenotypes each-- whereas this DLC has but one, 204 total hairstyles, this DLC has a handful, 271 total outfits and these have again but a handful. But the 3 added voice sets are well done as is the new human shipsets. Since I play a lot of this game I forked over the $8.

Martok

^  Thanks for the mini-review, GR.  For a cosmetic DLC, the Humanoids pack has been getting positive feedback thus far.  I was intending to get it just for the new music and voice-work alone. 



The next Dev Diary is up, and covers tech progression. 

[spoiler]
Technological Progression
In the 2.0 'Cherryh' update, we have made a number of changes to progression when it comes to technology. First of all, we have expanded on the number of technologies that empires start with. Rather than only starting with one type of weapon and no defensive or auxiliary utilities, all empires now start with basic Red Lasers, Mass Drivers, Nuclear Missiles, Deflectors and Armor, as well as a basic aux slot component in the form of Reactor Boosters that was covered in last week's dev diary. The reasoning for this is that we wanted to eliminate false choices and have some depth to ship design and counter-design available immediately on game start, rather than having to unlock several basic technologies before you could even start to vary your designs. With missiles moving to a dedicated torpedo slot (also covered in Dev Diary #96, this also means that the Torpedo/Missile Boat corvette layout is also immediately available.

Secondly, we have decided to increase the number of tech tiers in the game to make technological progression a more consistent experience. For those that do not know, each technology currently belongs to a tier between 1-4, with a certain number of tier 1 technologies being required before you can research tier 2 technologies in the same field, and so on. However, because the 4th tier is only used for end-game technologies like Mega-Engineering, this means that technologies with more than 3 steps such as reactors, shields and armor are spread haphazardly over the tiers, and it's not uncommon to have Cold Fusion research come up as available immediately after researching Fusion, for example. To better fit the tiers to the technologies we have, we have decided to increase the number of tiers to 5, with the tiers looking roughly like this:

    Tier 1: Basic Early Game Tech (Fusion, Automated Exploration, Robotic Workers, etc)
    Tier 2: Advanced Early Game Tech (Cold Fusion, Destroyers, Planetary Capital, etc)
    Tier 3: Basic Mid Game Tech (Antimatter, Cruisers, Wormholes, etc)
    Tier 4: Advanced Mid Game Tech (Zero Point Power, Battleships, Empire Capital, etc)
    Tier 5: Late-Game Tech (Mega-Engineering, Ascension Theory, Repeatables, etc)

We have also added a large number of new technologies to the game, both in the form of techs that handle new features (like Wormhole Stabilization and Space Trading) and to improve on existing ones, like a line of techs for each ship hull (Corvette, Destroyer, etc) that improves hull points and construction speed. Additionally, we have changed the general progression of ship components so that each upgrade is now more significant. For example, blue lasers now offer approximately 30% higher damage than red lasers, rather than a mere 10-15% as in the current live build. This should mean that focusing on technology is now an actual valid alternative to simply massing ships, though we still want to avoid the tech-as-only-viable-path-to-victory problem that many 4x games suffer from. Finally, we've also added some new highly advanced 'tier 6' technologies to Fallen Empires that cannot be researched normally and are only attainable by scavenging the wrecks of their ships.

Another thing that is changing in 2.0 'Cherryh' is tech costs and the tech penalty. Because of the new Starbase system and the fact that planets are no longer needed to control space, we felt that the old tech penalty based entirely on planets and pops was overly punitive and strongly encouraged having as few planets as possible and relying on space-based resources instead. For this reason, we have changed the Tech and Unity penalties to no longer be based on pops, but rather purely on the number of owned planets and systems, with each owned system and colonized planet adding to your tech and unity costs, and planets overall having less on an impact on tech costs than before. We have also raised the base cost of techs, particularly high tier techs, to compensate for the lowered penalties and slow down late-game tech progression so an empire doesn't have all technologies unlocked within the first century. This should not be taken as playing 'tall' now being unfeasible, just that it is no longer strictly about keeping few planets, but rather limiting the number of systems you expand to in order to benefit from lower tech/unity penalties and the ability to maintain a high ratio of upgraded starbases.

That's all for today! Next week's dev diary will also be about the Cherryh update, talking about a little usability feature that we call the Fleet Manager. See you then!
[/spoiler]



I'm definitely liking most of what's being proposed here.  This part in particular is my favorite: 

QuoteThis should mean that focusing on technology is now an actual valid alternative to simply massing ships, though we still want to avoid the tech-as-only-viable-path-to-victory problem that many 4x games suffer from. Finally, we've also added some new highly advanced 'tier 6' technologies to Fallen Empires that cannot be researched normally and are only attainable by scavenging the wrecks of their ships.


I do have some concerns that it will be even more difficult to build "tall" empires than before, but we shall see. 
"Like we need an excuse to drink to anything..." - Banzai_Cat
"I like to think of it not as an excuse but more like Pavlovian Response." - Sir Slash

"At our ages, they all look like jailbait." - mirth

"If we had lines here that would have crossed all of them. For the 1,077,986th time." - Gusington

"Government is so expensive that it should at least be entertaining." - airboy

"As long as there's bacon, everything will be all right." - Toonces

OJsDad

'Here at NASA we all pee the same color.'  Al Harrison from the movie Hidden Figures.

bbmike

When is the free 2.0 update?
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OJsDad

Not sure when 2.0 will release
'Here at NASA we all pee the same color.'  Al Harrison from the movie Hidden Figures.