due in july
https://www.esimgames.com/?page_id=1530
Oh my Dongle!
General question for people on this board: Roughly how many hours did it take to go from "what the hell am I doing" to "hey I'm actually having fun!" for this sim?
Quote from: al_infierno on June 30, 2019, 02:19:54 AM
General question for people on this board: Roughly how many hours did it take to go from "what the hell am I doing" to "hey I'm actually having fun!" for this sim?
i have owned it for many years....i had fun with it right from the start, but still likely don't know how to do everything:) i am not as good as others, nor likely as serious, but i have always felt i got my money worth even with the high prices. if your not sure, they have various time based licenses you could try first for cheaper initially.
Just shoot at the targets in the training range. It's a lot of fun.
Its not too daunting actually. There's good tutorials in the sim and a welcoming, helpful and mature online community (and online is the best way to get good). I've been playing on and off (mix of SP and regular MP) since 2006. I would not consider myself good even now, but it only took a few weeks to get the hang of the sim and how to stay alive in it.
So what exactly is new? I haven't been able to find a concise change log anywhere.
They said release notes in near future but believe this is largely the enhanced terrain features they were supposed to deliver with the last upgrade
Quote from: Grim.Reaper on June 30, 2019, 02:04:19 PM
They said release notes in near future but believe this is largely the enhanced terrain features they were supposed to deliver with the last upgrade
Wasn't that enhanced terrain to be released for free to owners of 4.0?
Pete, yes, but check their forum quite an extensive thread(s) about it.
Engineer functionality is new (or expanded); you can dig those tank emplacements with engineer units now.
Several new units will be added (dutch gear! yay!).
New (deformable) terrain engine.
Full suspension animations (or was that already in last upgrade?)
New tracer effects
New fragmentation calculation system (new HE modelling)
New environmental engine ((sun)light, water, weather)
New Anti-Air options and Programmable Ordnance
Better pathfinding for AI
Quote from: Pete Dero on June 30, 2019, 04:03:44 PM
Quote from: Grim.Reaper on June 30, 2019, 02:04:19 PM
They said release notes in near future but believe this is largely the enhanced terrain features they were supposed to deliver with the last upgrade
Wasn't that enhanced terrain to be released for free to owners of 4.0?
Originally yes, but not anymore....something about took longer and harder than they thought
Unlike tank crew they have infantry.
I have never gotten my money's worth out of Steel Beasts. I keep paying for the upgrades, I play it for an hour or so and decide that this is going to be the time when I learn the game properly....and then I forget all about it.
I think maybe I'll just pass this time and stick with the numerous "lite" tanks sims.
Quote from: Destraex on June 30, 2019, 05:30:45 PM
Unlike tank crew they have infantry.
Who whoa whoa. Let's pump the brakes on
thatATGM, LMG, HMG, AGLs, are all playable infantry units, and very nice to have because you have the freedom to operate them as a playable entity.
Riflemen, on the other hand, are not good. They can't be directly controlled and suffer big problems when it comes to effectively engaging anything.
It's really unfortunate, because it's such an immersion killer.
Apoc, the Rifleman issue was something that got better with 4.0 didn't it?
Quote from: Destraex on June 30, 2019, 05:30:45 PM
Unlike tank crew they have infantry.
At least Tank Crew actually has crew manning the tanks.
Quote from: Yskonyn on July 01, 2019, 01:50:18 AM
Apoc, the Rifleman issue was something that got better with 4.0 didn't it?
No. The video above is from 4.0.
Quote from: Toonces on June 30, 2019, 07:51:27 PM
I have never gotten my money's worth out of Steel Beasts. I keep paying for the upgrades, I play it for an hour or so and decide that this is going to be the time when I learn the game properly....and then I forget all about it.
I think maybe I'll just pass this time and stick with the numerous "lite" tanks sims.
I have a feeling I would fall into this category. I am not sure I agree with games being sold using the "Software as a Service" model. If it works for the SB folks, more power to them but I do suspect it may be impacting sales at some level. SaaS for things like Windows, Office, etc. where you are constantly using the software is one thing......games...not so much.
Quote from: DoctorQuest on July 01, 2019, 10:59:56 AM
Quote from: Toonces on June 30, 2019, 07:51:27 PM
I have never gotten my money's worth out of Steel Beasts. I keep paying for the upgrades, I play it for an hour or so and decide that this is going to be the time when I learn the game properly....and then I forget all about it.
I think maybe I'll just pass this time and stick with the numerous "lite" tanks sims.
I have a feeling I would fall into this category. I am not sure I agree with games being sold using the "Software as a Service" model. If it works for the SB folks, more power to them but I do suspect it may be impacting sales at some level. SaaS for things like Windows, Office, etc. where you are constantly using the software is one thing......games...not so much.
This issue, not unlike the Battlefront DRM issue, has been beaten to a bloody pulp...I happen to agree with you, but just wait until Ssnake shows up to set you straight. :crazy2:
Quote from: al_infierno on June 30, 2019, 02:19:54 AM
General question for people on this board: Roughly how many hours did it take to go from "what the hell am I doing" to "hey I'm actually having fun!" for this sim?
As life gets shorter, this is the leading question I have for every game, computer or board.
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on July 01, 2019, 11:12:02 AM
Quote from: DoctorQuest on July 01, 2019, 10:59:56 AM
Quote from: Toonces on June 30, 2019, 07:51:27 PM
I have never gotten my money's worth out of Steel Beasts. I keep paying for the upgrades, I play it for an hour or so and decide that this is going to be the time when I learn the game properly....and then I forget all about it.
I think maybe I'll just pass this time and stick with the numerous "lite" tanks sims.
I have a feeling I would fall into this category. I am not sure I agree with games being sold using the "Software as a Service" model. If it works for the SB folks, more power to them but I do suspect it may be impacting sales at some level. SaaS for things like Windows, Office, etc. where you are constantly using the software is one thing......games...not so much.
This issue, not unlike the Battlefront DRM issue, has been beaten to a bloody pulp...I happen to agree with you, but just wait until Ssnake shows up to set you straight. :crazy2:
Copy that. I'll put my bloody baseball bat away now. :bd:
Quote from: DoctorQuest on July 01, 2019, 10:59:56 AM
Quote from: Toonces on June 30, 2019, 07:51:27 PM
I have never gotten my money's worth out of Steel Beasts. I keep paying for the upgrades, I play it for an hour or so and decide that this is going to be the time when I learn the game properly....and then I forget all about it.
I think maybe I'll just pass this time and stick with the numerous "lite" tanks sims.
I have a feeling I would fall into this category. I am not sure I agree with games being sold using the "Software as a Service" model. If it works for the SB folks, more power to them but I do suspect it may be impacting sales at some level. SaaS for things like Windows, Office, etc. where you are constantly using the software is one thing......games...not so much.
I'm normally a DRM basher (see the CMx2 patch thread right now).
However, I think the hardware token method is a lot better than all the DRM that is activation driven, and by a lot:
- as long as the hardware key doesn't break you can play forever
- if you change hardware or move to a new computer you would normally have to use up an activation. And obviously if the vendor went away you are unable to play. The hardware token is much better here since you can play whereever you drag the token to
Now, the remaining problem is the token breaking after the vendor goes away. So it is not really fulfilling the "I own" premise. But you have the time between the vendor going away and the token breaking that is play time you don't have with the regular DRM insanity. Also, this makes it more similar to a physical "I own" item. If I own an ipod out of warranty and I physically break it the situation is similar.
update on release date from developer....
Okay, I can now confirm that 4.1 Release Day will be
not before Monday 22nd
probably on Wednesday 24th
no later than Monday 29th
Final build will be this week, then there's one week for final tests and production of the bundles, commissioning the bundles, shipping.
Sounds like July 29th is the date...
release notes
https://www.steelbeasts.com/updates/SBProPE_4_156_Release_Notes.pdf
That was a very convoluted release notes, would have been nice to get a quick summary page instead of wading through that whole thing.
I did notice they listed the Armata AFV as a "new system", are those crewable ?
Either way, that would be some interesting match ups with the M1 SEP. Interesting to see if Steel Beasts makes the Armata as good as the Russians say it is or if it's just hype.
The new map installer will be made available tomorrow to download...large file of 30+GB I believe. Kind of a preload before the actual new version is released next Monday.
maps available for pre load
https://www.esimgames.com/?page_id=1607
new game version releases monday
*** In total maps were about 13GB to download, thought I had read somewhere a lot bigger but maybe that is after they are expanded....didn't take much time at all. Just now need the main game files on Monday:)
and version 4.1 and day one patch
https://www.steelbeasts.com/topic/13009-4156-preliminary-download-links/
Quote from: Grim.Reaper on July 29, 2019, 03:10:42 AM
and version 4.1 and day one patch
https://www.steelbeasts.com/topic/13009-4156-preliminary-download-links/
SB Pro PE Maps Installer – to install, download all the archives below to the same folder, along with the maps installer executable. Then run the maps installer executable once all the files have finished downloading,.
-> 10 files
SB Pro Maps Download Manager
This tool is used to get maps from the eSimGames map server.
SB Pro Maps Downloader v17
-> 1 file Is SB Pro Maps Downloader an alternative to downloading the 10 files (SP Pro PE Maps Installer) or is this an extra thing you need ?
you must download the 10 files.....from what read the map downloader is something for future map sharing.
Can someone please summarize the biggest new features offered by this update?
Don't believe I have seen a summary, but best source is the release guide.
https://www.steelbeasts.com/updates/SBProPE_4_156_Release_Notes.pdf
New terrain graphics, bug fixes, better pathfinding, and seems like according to the book much more.
Yeah...I've seen the release notes. I was looking for a summary from someone who has been following development for a more meaningful assessment of how the update will improve the experience.
Quote from: Yskonyn on June 30, 2019, 04:16:27 PM
Pete, yes, but check their forum quite an extensive thread(s) about it.
Engineer functionality is new (or expanded); you can dig those tank emplacements with engineer units now.
Several new units will be added (dutch gear! yay!).
New (deformable) terrain engine.
Full suspension animations (or was that already in last upgrade?)
New tracer effects
New fragmentation calculation system (new HE modelling)
New environmental engine ((sun)light, water, weather)
New Anti-Air options and Programmable Ordnance
Better pathfinding for AI
MANY new units btw!
MLRS and Howitzer artillery units are added as well.
Oh and better first person Infantry handling.
You can also check the video series Ssnake put up these last weeks on YT.
Its a big beefy update and the 4.1 tag doesn't reflect its size IMO. Easily 4.5.
Quote from: Yskonyn on July 29, 2019, 09:45:33 AM
Quote from: Yskonyn on June 30, 2019, 04:16:27 PM
Pete, yes, but check their forum quite an extensive thread(s) about it.
Engineer functionality is new (or expanded); you can dig those tank emplacements with engineer units now.
Several new units will be added (dutch gear! yay!).
New (deformable) terrain engine.
Full suspension animations (or was that already in last upgrade?)
New tracer effects
New fragmentation calculation system (new HE modelling)
New environmental engine ((sun)light, water, weather)
New Anti-Air options and Programmable Ordnance
Better pathfinding for AI
MANY new units btw!
MLRS and Howitzer artillery units are added as well.
Oh and better first person Infantry handling.
You can also check the video series Ssnake put up these last weeks on YT.
Its a big beefy update and the 4.1 tag doesn't reflect its size IMO. Easily 4.5.
Good summary...I am not an expert at this game, so not really sure how much of a difference this all makes, but $25 was low risk for me. I'll admit reading their forums, I am pretty confused by all the map talk so hopefully not too complicated...also saw a couple of people with performance issues, but maybe just their computers.
Had framerate issues as well.
Reduced Anti-Aliasing to 2 and Dynamic Cache to minimum (the cache is used
For jumping large distances over the map). FPS back to 50+
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on July 29, 2019, 08:54:41 AM
Yeah...I've seen the release notes. I was looking for a summary from someone who has been following development for a more meaningful assessment of how the update will improve the experience.
You're asking for a highly subjective assessment.
My take is,
- Better Framerates
...with medium and high end gaming machines, and with the right settings, that is. Old computers may actually see worse framerates, and it seems like the default settings aren't the best possible ones for people with just 8GByte RAM and two or less GByte video memory ... soo, depending on whom you ask and how deeply they looked into the matter you may get mixed answers - Better looks
That I think goes undisputed. We've replaced the whole scene lighting, and the high resolution terrain (even if it's just converted lower res legacy maps) looks generally a lot more realistic because of the combination of micro-variations and said improved lighting. Plus, much nicer looking particle effects, particularly tracers. Further improved vehicle suspension simulation. - More terrain variety
"Africa" may finally look like "Africa", as the prime example of the expanded range of region-specific terrain objects. If you aren't interested in scenarios like Libyan "Toyota Wars", or "Angola" then maybe this isn't so relevant. But then again you can now also better replicate different regions of moderate climate zones; the new theme files simply cover an overall broader range - Dynamic terrain
IEDs will now leave craters, engineer vehicles can dig more useful emplacements, and dig them at runtime - Modern adversaries
You can now have peer level threats without having to pitch Leopards against M1s - even if in real life Armatas and Kurganets family vehicles aren't so prevalent. AT-14 Kornet missiles for infantry (and for you).
Active protection systems add another element of tactical depth. - Overhead View
This is not a new feature, but one which I believe is underreported and underappreciated, when it should appeal especially to wargamers. This turns SB Pro PE into a real-time "strategy" (well, tactics) game as most of the UI elements are concerned. So you don't have to deal with shooting yourself and learning all the details of the different fire control systems if you don't want to; note that the overhead view needs to be explicitly activated in a scenario, but that's what the integrated Mission Editor is for.
This ties in with (much) improved pathfinding for infantry, and vehicles. - More detailed AARs
Maybe you ARE interested in what, specifically, caused a certain damage, how Pvt Nameless was killed by artillery (a fragment? overpressure? both? could a protective vest have saved him?), how an airburst of an artillery shell sprinkles the ground below with fragments. In that case the new AAR is made for you. But of course you can gloss over most of that. In any case, I believe that the way we're visualizing things is relatively intuitive. - Camera Animation Window
If there's a war movie film director in you that wants to get out: Testing a mission, jumping to the free-flight camera, pausing the 3D scene (this is the new feature) and hitting Alt+Space brings up a dialog where you can define keyframes that will then be connected with a 3D spline along which the camera will be moved as soon as you hit Alt+Space again (and then unpause the scenario). This allows you to become writer, director, cameraman, and editor of your own little war movies. I demonstrated that with some of our recent YouTube videos (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CM752mWJ2aY&list=PLhlC7w0j9LXn2nyh7jUGHQyhXP5pf6mnx).
For better or for worth, this is "my" list of things that change "the experience".
Quote from: DoctorQuest on July 01, 2019, 10:59:56 AM
Quote from: Toonces on June 30, 2019, 07:51:27 PM
I have never gotten my money's worth out of Steel Beasts. I keep paying for the upgrades, I play it for an hour or so and decide that this is going to be the time when I learn the game properly....and then I forget all about it.
I think maybe I'll just pass this time and stick with the numerous "lite" tanks sims.
I have a feeling I would fall into this category. I am not sure I agree with games being sold using the "Software as a Service" model. If it works for the SB folks, more power to them but I do suspect it may be impacting sales at some level. SaaS for things like Windows, Office, etc. where you are constantly using the software is one thing......games...not so much.
We're giving everybody the
choice to pick whatever license model suits them best.
You can have permanent licenses (and we offer upgrades at reduced prices going back even to the oldest Steel Beasts Pro PE licenses ever sold).
In response to the claims that our permanent licenses were too expensive and therefore limit our sales (which I suspected to be hogwash back then, a suspicion that I can now confirm) we then also introduced low priced licenses that are limited in their duration. If you just want to try it out: There's one-month licenses. If you know you won't play it for much longer than two or three months: There's the four-month license. If you think you will play it for a long time, but with occasional breaks: The one-year license is for you.
Yes, it's possible to look at it from the SaaS angle but you can just as well forget about that and simply think of each license being "a game" that you play for a while. And if you happen to discover that you like it a lot more than originally anticipated you can either switch to licenses that last longer, or the permanent option. Many people play a new game for two or three months, until the next "must play" one comes along. In that case $24.50 will give you that "four month" option, and Steel Beasts won't cost you an arm and a leg. Just sayin'...
If you treat Steel Beasts as an RTS by playing it primarily from the overhead view (something that you must enable in the mission editor, but that's really simple to do) you don't have to bother with the intricacies of fire control systems and their switchology. And in that case, I think, the learning curve isn't steep at all (except for one thing, that you need to learn about your units' and adversaries' capabilities, but that's nothing new for a wargamer).
Quote from: Ssnake on July 31, 2019, 04:23:33 AM
We're giving everybody the choice to pick whatever license model suits them best.
You can have permanent licenses (and we offer upgrades at reduced prices going back even to the oldest Steel Beasts Pro PE licenses ever sold).
Choice is the key word there. I, personally, hate software that is not a service being sold by subscription. But in truth, what I actually hate is when a company does not give you any choice - other than not buying that is. The various scenarios that Ssnake outlines for different choices is pretty awesome actually. If people have the choice between a perpetual license, and yearly licenses and some short term options that is a nice amount of flexibility.
Some people are a bit gun shy over the subscription choice being available because of the history of companies introducing such a choice and then removing the choice of perpetual license. How long has SB been available with these licensing choices? Has there been any statements by the company about future directions or their philosophy surrounding licensing?
Quote from: A Canadian Cat on July 31, 2019, 08:41:56 AM
Some people are a bit gun shy over the subscription choice being available because of the history of companies introducing such a choice and then removing the choice of perpetual license. How long has SB been available with these licensing choices? Has there been any statements by the company about future directions or their philosophy surrounding licensing?
We introduced time-based licenses six years ago with version 3.0
We intend to maintain this option, or possibly to replace it with an option where the license wouldn't be stored locally but on a cloud server, thus being made secure against Windows reinstallations. Even if we decided to change the product policy at some point, this would not invalidate already purchased licenses. After all, Steel Beasts license management up to this point is locally contained; once that a ticket is purchased we have a contractual obligation to deliver it, and once that it's activated we can't pull it from your PC. We have deliberately minimized our influence past the point of sale. Even when it's a time based license, it still is YOUR license.
Do you have a list of what's currently crewable / internal gunner station modeled in game ? Are the new Armatas crewable or AI only ?
Quote from: Ssnake on July 31, 2019, 11:25:51 AM
Quote from: A Canadian Cat on July 31, 2019, 08:41:56 AM
Some people are a bit gun shy over the subscription choice being available because of the history of companies introducing such a choice and then removing the choice of perpetual license. How long has SB been available with these licensing choices? Has there been any statements by the company about future directions or their philosophy surrounding licensing?
We introduced time-based licenses six years ago with version 3.0
We intend to maintain this option, or possibly to replace it with an option where the license wouldn't be stored locally but on a cloud server, thus being made secure against Windows reinstallations. Even if we decided to change the product policy at some point, this would not invalidate already purchased licenses. After all, Steel Beasts license management up to this point is locally contained; once that a ticket is purchased we have a contractual obligation to deliver it, and once that it's activated we can't pull it from your PC. We have deliberately minimized our influence past the point of sale. Even when it's a time based license, it still is YOUR license.
Is the clock you use play time or calendar time?
Quote from: DoctorQuest on August 01, 2019, 03:16:45 PM
Is the clock you use play time or calendar time?
To try out the game before buying I took a one month licence a couple of years ago and it was one month calender time.
(one month 24 hours a day play time would equal around 5 years calender time for me ...)
Here is a nice comparison video of the new and old.
Quote from: Pete Dero on August 02, 2019, 02:30:00 AM
Quote from: DoctorQuest on August 01, 2019, 03:16:45 PM
Is the clock you use play time or calendar time?
To try out the game before buying I took a one month licence a couple of years ago and it was one month calender time.
(one month 24 hours a day play time would equal around 5 years calender time for me ...)
Thanks, Pete.
Quote from: Skoop on August 01, 2019, 02:43:49 PM
Do you have a list of what's currently crewable / internal gunner station modeled in game ? Are the new Armatas crewable or AI only ?
a) Units shown below in black text are with crew positions (with the exception of helicopters, an artifact of the developer version from which I composed this picture); grey text means they can only be controlled externally
b) Yes.
Orange arrows indicate new/significantly altered units, red arrows indicate units that were there before, but in a different menu.
(https://www.grogheads.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fssnake.org%2FPE41%2FV4-1_Most_Units.jpg&hash=866d962dc0903cfdbe3b8f2953a88e4dc4a9c47b)
Reasl and Simulated Wars did a post about the Steal Beasts update. May be of interest
http://rswars.com/steel-beasts-prope-4-157-apc-and-infantry-coordination/
Patch 4.159 posted:
http://dl.steelbeasts.com/SBProPE_4-159_RN.pdf
They finally added bouncy wheels, that was the big wishlist joke from 10 years ago.....irritate esims by asking for bouncy wheel suspensions. Looks like the new terrain finally made this possible, that makes this a definite buy now. Plus my "H.A.L." NASA computer (i9@5.3Ghz and an RTX Titan 24Gb vram) that I built for P3D will probably eat this for lunch with everything maxed out. Would have loved to drive some armatas around, but blowing them up with M1s is good enough.
I love playing the 73 Easting Scenario...so awesome.
Quote from: Skoop on August 09, 2019, 04:28:26 PM
They finally added bouncy wheels, that was the big wishlist joke from 10 years ago.....irritate esims by asking for bouncy wheel suspensions.
Would this be the bouncy wheel thing?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4d3onSCvMUE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4d3onSCvMUE)