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Radio Commander...

Started by Jarhead0331, January 17, 2019, 07:10:52 PM

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planetbrain

#45
Quote from: braaaur on March 26, 2019, 03:41:33 PM


PS. If you are looking for a game very similar to Radio Commander (the idea) but without narration, you may want to check Radio General by Foolish Mortals.
http://www.foolish-mortals.net/radiogeneral
Radio General might be the go then.
It will be from Saskatoon, Saskatchewan and I just love saying "Saskatoon, Saskatchewan"
Mostly harmless

FarAway Sooner

braaaur, welcome to the board and thanks for coming here!

My own sense is that effective story-telling in games is a sorely neglected craft, but trying to work political commentary into a historical game's story line only works if you bring ENORMOUS credibility to the table.  If you address something like that, you need great understanding of the nuances, and very authentic handling of the topic (e.g., lots of talking to people from many different perspectives who were part of whatever you're commenting on). 

It sounds like you're a European developer team trying to tackle issues about which the American debate rages on hotly.  For the sake of your game design, I'd encourage you to consider removing political strands from what claims to be a historical game.  (A Polish developer creating a game that explores the intricacies of the Nazi Holocaust might be more appropriate for your shop?)

Games like the original Valkyria Chronicles title played adroitly with adult themes, by creating a fictional race that seemed awfully reminiscent of European Jews, but they called them by another name.  The same messages about humanity came across, but without the historical baggage.

I wish you luck in your craft here, but if you play fast and loose with your history based on some imagination of how things happened, I don't think you'll end up reaching the audience you hope to reach.


JasonPratt

I for one am encouraged by Braaaur's post, and particularly the part about making the story broadcasts optional.  O0

Another possibility would be to find some way to make the story dialogue not take place on an open mic channel.
ICEBREAKER THESIS CHRONOLOGY! -- Victor Suvorov's Stalin Grand Strategy theory, in lots and lots of chronological order...
Dawn of Armageddon -- narrative AAR for Dawn of War: Soulstorm: Ultimate Apocalypse
Survive Harder! -- Two season narrative AAR, an Amazon Blood Bowl career.
PanzOrc Corpz Generals -- Fantasy Wars narrative AAR, half a combined campaign.
Khazâd du-bekâr! -- narrative dwarf AAR for LotR BfME2 RotWK campaign.
RobO Q Campaign Generator -- archived classic CMBB/CMAK tool!

JasonPratt

That Radio General concept development looks sharp as hell, too! (Not the same devs, I know, but I appreciate Braaaur pointing us that way.)
ICEBREAKER THESIS CHRONOLOGY! -- Victor Suvorov's Stalin Grand Strategy theory, in lots and lots of chronological order...
Dawn of Armageddon -- narrative AAR for Dawn of War: Soulstorm: Ultimate Apocalypse
Survive Harder! -- Two season narrative AAR, an Amazon Blood Bowl career.
PanzOrc Corpz Generals -- Fantasy Wars narrative AAR, half a combined campaign.
Khazâd du-bekâr! -- narrative dwarf AAR for LotR BfME2 RotWK campaign.
RobO Q Campaign Generator -- archived classic CMBB/CMAK tool!

Gusington

Welcome Braaaur.

And someone get Porkins.


слава Україна!

We can't live under the threat of a c*nt because he's threatening nuclear Armageddon.

-JudgeDredd

Apocalypse 31

#50
QuoteWe decided that we want to tell a story in RC. This story involves politics, racism and uses very uncommon way to be told. We believe that every war is political. So basically, Radio Commander tries to tell that war is not about units, statistics, orders etc. but about people trapped there
.

You are disrespecting those who have been there and the memory of those lost there by using racist and political narrative in your game.

QuoteIt sounds like you're a European developer team trying to tackle issues about which the American debate rages on hotly.  For the sake of your game design, I'd encourage you to consider removing political strands from what claims to be a historical game. 

Well said! My initial impression is somewhat similar, except I think this is a developer with no regard for the vietnam war, rather someone using an existing game concept and applying it to a Vietnam setting.

I'm guessing Russian developer.

JasonPratt

Quote from: Apocalypse 31 on March 26, 2019, 06:07:39 PM
I'm guessing Russian developer.

...um, he's Polish.

Could be a commie sympathizer I suppose, but he could also just like certain popular Vietnam films (perhaps without realizing the politics of the creators behind those films), and wants his game to be like that.

This theory has the advantage of being the explicitly stated intent of the developer, too.  O:-)
ICEBREAKER THESIS CHRONOLOGY! -- Victor Suvorov's Stalin Grand Strategy theory, in lots and lots of chronological order...
Dawn of Armageddon -- narrative AAR for Dawn of War: Soulstorm: Ultimate Apocalypse
Survive Harder! -- Two season narrative AAR, an Amazon Blood Bowl career.
PanzOrc Corpz Generals -- Fantasy Wars narrative AAR, half a combined campaign.
Khazâd du-bekâr! -- narrative dwarf AAR for LotR BfME2 RotWK campaign.
RobO Q Campaign Generator -- archived classic CMBB/CMAK tool!

The_Admiral

#52
@ Apocalypse 31
If you may, I beg to differ strongly with this analysis.

First, a word of context.

I don't post in here much, but I have been reading a lot – and the Groghead community gives me the feeling it is one of these made of reasonable people, who more often than not are willing to answer to cooler heads and arguments over passion, and also every now and then give an underdog his chance. As the single most palpable trend of bigotry present on this forum, wargaming bigotry is quite fine by me.
Besides, regarding Radio Commander, I have no stake in it beyond the few bucks I have pledged for the Kickstarter. My interest in this story lies entirely with the wish not to let an innovative, creative team get bogged down in a controversy when in my humble opinion, there's hardly any probable cause at all. Considering their honest intents, these people deserve none of this shaming, and it kind of pains me to see that sort of dirt thrown at them.

First of all, as pointed out just earlier, had you read anything surrounding the game besides watching videos, then you'd know the team is made of Poles. Which is kinda funny, because by calling them Russians you managed to find the single most offensive way to characterize him, and you're showing the exact kind of bigotry you've been pointing a finger at by jumping to conclusions based on your own misconceptions. That's quite a feat all packed into a single sentence, I kid you not.

Now, about disrespecting the vets... It is all the more remarkable an accusation knowing that some of the most noticeable US-made war dramas of these last 50 years have been pretty much vehicles for social and political commentary as much as actual war movies – not to say even more so. You are publicly vilifying this game and its creators for something MASH, Apocalypse Now, Full Metal Jacket or Generation Kill did way before them, on the sole basis of them not being Americans (or even, to re-use your vocabulary, for being "Russians, I guess") and as such insensitive and non-qualified when it comes to the topic. Hell, even the "Family-friendly" adventure that was Band of Brothers made a point about showing how a ragtag of misfits ended up building a bond, beyond their personal bias and misconceptions, by living and fighting together for a greater goal, in a (glorious) footnote to a struggle that was way bigger than their own inner demons.

It is true that Vietnam is the first conflict in which fresh, non-segregated, draft-era US Forces found themselves thrown in, at a times when Civil Rights, Anti-War protestations & the struggle against Communism were blanketing the headlines at home. If there's a modern "social war" out there that has shaped the mental and political landscape for decades thereafter, and still haunts consciences, it's this one.  I for one would believe that any product that doesn't take the opportunity to revisit the political and social mood of the times would be failing at its goal more than anything.

As a final remark, on the contrary, I do not believe that being a non-US production deprives the team's work of its legitimacy at all. I mean, beyond the sort of freedom of speech they are entitled to, I grew up in a world where I learned not to have any issue with seeing Hollywood and its gaming counterparts' insensible clutches all around my history and heritage. And even though it is often for the worse (Battlefield V comes to mind...), sometimes it genuinely results in interesting experiences. Paths of Glory was made about a topic the French were not ready to talk about. Lost command was made about a war the French are still not ready to talk about. The Beast (of War), although a completely a Western fantasy, remains after all these years one of the best movies about the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan, featuring characters who have for sole common point their complete imperfection and their respective bigotries. No later than this week, I said in another topic that I enjoyed in the idea of trying out We. The Revolution as the single best gaming experience offered about the era, even though it was made by them Poles, yet again.

These are all, in their own way, great movies and games. Beyond – or including its social commentary –  if the writing manages to stay up to the standards set by its production values, I fully expect Radio Commander to mature into a great game too.

And as an endnote: one might disagree with their choice of putting in some drama in there. But then just don't forget about what is running under the hood too. The engine is highly adaptable and resilient from what I can see, and it just might be the beginning of many things to come, including some certainly closer to your hearts. Let it die because you're offended or just sad about the path they chose, and it will be the beginning of nothing. I don't care much about the Nam, in all honestly, but I'd like to see that engine play new melodies sooner than later. Wouldn't you?

My two cents, over & out!

Jarhead0331

Quote from: The_Admiral on March 27, 2019, 10:37:03 AM

My two cents, over & out!

Since we're talking about authenticity and radio comms...you would just say, "out". Never "over & out". That just confuses the hell out of people and pisses them off.  :crazy2:
Grogheads Uber Alles
Semper Grog
"No beast is more alpha than JH." Gusington, 10/23/18


Gusington

And never say 'repeat.' I'll just leave that one there.


слава Україна!

We can't live under the threat of a c*nt because he's threatening nuclear Armageddon.

-JudgeDredd

SirAndrewD

Quote from: Gusington on March 27, 2019, 01:04:44 PM
And never say 'repeat.' I'll just leave that one there.

Say again?
"These men do not want a happy ship. They are deeply sick and try to compensate by making me feel miserable. Last week was my birthday. Nobody even said "happy birthday" to me. Someday this tape will be played and then they'll feel sorry."  - Sgt. Pinback

FarAway Sooner

So, what I hear you guys saying is that it's okay to end your transmission with the phrase "Over and out, I repeat, over and out!"?

Apocalypse 31

Quote from: Gusington on March 27, 2019, 01:04:44 PM
And never say 'repeat.' I'll just leave that one there.

Repeat is totally acceptable for radio comms when you need your Gun Bunnies to sling a few more rounds. Also, artillery and mortar rounds don't just fire off themselves when someone says REPEAT into a hand mic. There's an entire string of phrases and functions that need to established before repeating a fire mission.


QuoteFirst of all, as pointed out just earlier, had you read anything surrounding the game besides watching videos, then you'd know the team is made of Poles. Which is kinda funny, because by calling them Russians you managed to find the single most offensive way to characterize him, and you're showing the exact kind of bigotry you've been pointing a finger at by jumping to conclusions based on your own misconceptions. That's quite a feat all packed into a single sentence, I kid you not

I saw the Polish comment after I posted, but honestly,
I don't care if the entire team is made up of Nobel Prize winners. The image that they are portraying about a war they blatantly know nothing about is ridiculous and seems like Russian themes and messaging about US conflicts. Good job developers, I just classified you as your enemy by accident...that's how far off you are.

SirAndrewD

Quote from: FarAway Sooner on March 27, 2019, 02:45:44 PM
So, what I hear you guys saying is that it's okay to end your transmission with the phrase "Over and out, I repeat, over and out!"?

Roger Wilco.
"These men do not want a happy ship. They are deeply sick and try to compensate by making me feel miserable. Last week was my birthday. Nobody even said "happy birthday" to me. Someday this tape will be played and then they'll feel sorry."  - Sgt. Pinback

Apocalypse 31

Quote from: FarAway Sooner on March 27, 2019, 02:45:44 PM
So, what I hear you guys saying is that it's okay to end your transmission with the phrase "Over and out, I repeat, over and out!"?

Over = my transmission is complete but I am still monitoring
Out = my transmission is complete and I am off the net

You never OUT your commander, as it is like hanging up the phone on him.

When handling radio comms, I prefer "nothing further, out". This let's the reviever clearly know that I am ending the transmission and off the net.