High Frontier

Started by DicedT, April 19, 2012, 05:33:07 PM

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Rekim

HF looks fantastic. I really want to grab a copy once it goes retail. The amount of negative buzz surrounding the rules has me thinking 4th edition.

Thanks for sharing your experience, Nefaro.

Nefaro

Quote from: Rekim on April 04, 2017, 08:33:25 AM
HF looks fantastic. I really want to grab a copy once it goes retail. The amount of negative buzz surrounding the rules has me thinking 4th edition.

Thanks for sharing your experience, Nefaro.

:)



The rules are probably better than those from previous editions.  Hell, I have another of Phil Eklund's scienc-y games, Bios: Megafauna, and the original rulebook in that one is pretty sketchy on details.  The ones in previous versions of HF were reportedly in a similar style. 

These rules for HF3 are probably a big leap ahead, despite some of the dual-use terminology not being used uniformly throughout.  For example, I regularly see two different words being used for the same thing.  For example mentioning, "the Green Player" and "the ESA Player" in different sentences of the rules.  They mean the exact same thing, but no single one is used throughout.  I had also read no part of the rules which make this color + player equivalency connection beforehand.  Had to figure that out, all on my own, after noticing such repeated discrepancies in the rulebook and checking the player cards for differences in color.  Minor detective work.  ;D

Despite a handful of such examples, and the occasionally ambiguous sentence that is often clarified in the Glossary terms, or a different but related rule, I've been able to learn much of it.  The Advanced Rules will take plenty trial run time to get it all memorized, but after playing the Basic Game I don't feel overwhelmed in doing so.
:nerd:


Also - I wouldn't be surprised if another version was eventually released some years down the road.  They never seem to make many extra copies of Eklund's games so they're always "out of print" for long stretches.  But who knows how long that would take?   I'm happy with what I got in 3rd Edition, thus far, despite needing some definitive FAQs on some things. 

egg_salad

I have a copy of the 3rd edition too -- I am very happy with it also.

Unfortunately, from what I have heard, it will never go to retail.  They made enough for the KS folks, there were some limited copies you could preorder direct from OSS, but they are all supposedly accounted for.  They mentioned when all the preorders ship, they may have a few left over, but that's about it.

QuoteHave had a couple inquiries about High Frontier being sold out. Once the dust settles from all the shipping we'll be taking an inventory of what's left (not much). If we find enough copies remain, we will put them back up for sale (but there won't be very many).
Source: http://talk.consimworld.com/WebX?14@@.1dcdf87b/1702

The designer is already talking about a 4th edition, but not with the same publisher (there was some drama, apparently).
A)bort, R)etry, I)nfluence with large hammer

Nefaro

#18
Quote from: egg_salad on April 05, 2017, 08:36:37 AM


The designer is already talking about a 4th edition, but not with the same publisher (there was some drama, apparently).


The publisher dragged it's feet in getting the components to the printer over a year.  During that time, the KS backers kept being told the proofs were "on the way" and the printing would start within the month (three times IIRC), in the rare KS updates, but that wasn't the case. 

When the backers were getting up in arms after noticing the discrepancy in what they were being told & what was happening.  Some understandably began thinking they were being lied to.  A few of those began requesting refunds to only be told that the money had been spent on printing long ago.  So that was the stinky situation for a year & a half.

After awhile Ekland (the original game designer) stated the if the game isn't actually in production by the 2-year mark that he would pay for the printing to be done.  Out of his own pocket.  All he did was sign off on Ares (3rd Ed publisher) making the new edition, having no direct involvement with the KS for 3rd edition AFAIK. 

Guess this turn lit a fire under Ares' ass in some way.  Who had, after this, began blaming delays on the Chinese print company (one of the most popular designer board game printers) for rejecting some of their files as unsatisfactory and requesting more.  At least that's what someone at Ares told us in a couple updates, over the next few months.

I expected it to show up.. eventually.  Just not sure in what form.  So I sat back and watched this mess unfold for awhile.

That they didn't make many extras in the print run - I'm not surprised.  This is complete guesswork, but I got the impression that the KS publisher dropped the HF3 funds into all their projects, early on, and was scraping to cover it in the end.  Along with some mention of the printing company wanting to renegotiate the printing fees since the original estimate was well over a year old by the time printing was being considered again.



TL;DR:

This edition/revision, which was supposed to be done and printed within a few months, ended up taking nearly two years from the KS start.  Due to the company running the KS dragging their heels much of the time.  Likely too busy with other production, KS, and such to bother with it for long stretches.  Until the original designer chimed in and mentioned that he would take over if they didn't deliver by a certain time.  Which finally got the ball rolling.  Arrived a year and a half after estimated delivery, but the complaints were primarily about months going by without updates, no progress, and especially the few updates saying "going to the printers next month!" being false.


egg_salad

Yes, I was a KS backer too.  I tend to just try to forget I backed something and then be pleasantly surprised if it shows up.  So I guess my expectations were so low, all the shenanigans did not bother me. 

And, apparently, the designer has not heard from OSS/Ares since 2015.
https://beta.groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Paxgames/conversations/messages/312

It is a mess.
A)bort, R)etry, I)nfluence with large hammer

Nefaro

#20
For those looking to get it:

Apparently OSS has a very small amount of them left for sale on their site. 


http://ossgamescart.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1&products_id=75


A few retailers should be getting a few, too, although I wouldn't be surprised if they quickly sold out.  Maybe even from just pre-orders.

HF3 isn't cheap.  Nor light, at 11 lbs, so the shipping likely isn't cheap either.



.............................


Finished reading through the Advanced Rules this last week. 

Will probably start up a Solitaire game with all the advanced rule modules (except Warfare) sometime soon.  Also have some miniature painting calling to me, though, so.. decisions.

Barthheart

There's currently 24 at that site.
With shipping to my US address it comes to $128 USD... not so bad until you translate that to CDN  = $172!  >:(  :'(
I don't mind paying a $100 for a game but almost $200 for one that will not get played with my group.....

Rekim


egg_salad

Quote from: Rekim on April 15, 2017, 06:44:59 AM
Quote from: Barthheart on April 09, 2017, 05:52:05 AM
There's currently 24 at that site.

all gone now  :P

There's going to be one final batch of 100 for sale sometime soon, supposedly.
Source:  http://talk.consimworld.com/WebX?14@@.1dcdf87b/1750
A)bort, R)etry, I)nfluence with large hammer

Rekim

Quote from: egg_salad on April 20, 2017, 08:32:11 AM
There's going to be one final batch of 100 for sale sometime soon, supposedly.
Source:  http://talk.consimworld.com/WebX?14@@.1dcdf87b/1750

Thanks for the tip ES. That post states that they will be putting the batch of 100 up for sale on a website, but doesn't mention a URL/site. Any idea which site?

Same post also alludes to a shit-ton of drama going down during the KS campaign. Doesn't sound like the developer is walking away with a warm & fuzzy feeling from the experience.

Barthheart

From a post on BGG:

QuoteThere will be about 100 copies for sale from OSS's website. I would not expect them to last long.
http://talk.consimworld.com/WebX?14@@.1dcdf87b/1750


Rekim

Guess they'll be sold on the same One Small Step website you provided a link to previously

http://ossgamescart.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1&products_id=75

Rekim

Barthheart - if you're still on the fence (as I am)....I could potentially be your local HF buddy.

Barthheart

Quote from: Rekim on April 20, 2017, 09:15:37 AM
Barthheart - if you're still on the fence (as I am)....I could potentially be your local HF buddy.

:D At least then we'd have someone to play it with.

Rekim

Quote from: Barthheart on April 20, 2017, 09:18:37 AM
Quote from: Rekim on April 20, 2017, 09:15:37 AM
Barthheart - if you're still on the fence (as I am)....I could potentially be your local HF buddy.

:D At least then we'd have someone to play it with.

Yes! That, plus slightly better excuse for the boss following my next visit from Mr. UPS; 'But...I told Vance if he bought a copy, I would buy a copy. And wouldn't you know it...'