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ARMA 3

Started by Toonces, February 20, 2015, 03:32:30 PM

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Jarhead0331

^These are definitely intense. Be prepared to sweat!  :2funny:
Grogheads Uber Alles
Semper Grog
"No beast is more alpha than JH." Gusington, 10/23/18


Yskonyn

#331
There are two things I find super annoying of Arma 3's AI;
- There is no way to lay down supressive fire without resorting to mods.
- The AI makes units behave erratic and super stupid at times in their decision making logic. As a result you can never trust them to do their job.

A pet peeve it the wonky pathfinding, but not nearly as big an issue.
The points above make me choose Steal Beasts over Arma 3 when we talk about combined arms operations. The AI in SB is braindead if you don't take the time to create a control logic setup in a mission, but if you do (and your plan is sound) you can absolutely rely on the AI to do its job.
Not so much in (vanilla) Arma. How I wish SB had the graphical prowess of Arma...
"Pilots do not get paid for what they do daily, but they get paid for what they are capable of doing.
However, if pilots would need to do daily what they are capable of doing, nobody would dare to fly anymore."

Jarhead0331

#332
ARMA excels with good mission planning and scripting. The best missions are the ones where the AI has been given detailed and authentic behavioral routines by the scenario designer.
Grogheads Uber Alles
Semper Grog
"No beast is more alpha than JH." Gusington, 10/23/18


RyanE

ARMA scripting is a little more difficult and it doesn't have workable SOPs like in SB, but if you put the same care into planning your mission, you can get excellent results from ARMA3.  ARMA3 is a little more difficult to get realistic artillery working, but it can be done.

Yskonyn

How do you guys do this at runtime then? Clearly you know something I do not.
And how do you guys lay down suppressive fire by AI?
"Pilots do not get paid for what they do daily, but they get paid for what they are capable of doing.
However, if pilots would need to do daily what they are capable of doing, nobody would dare to fly anymore."

Jarhead0331

Thought this video was worth posting for people who are still non-believers.

Grogheads Uber Alles
Semper Grog
"No beast is more alpha than JH." Gusington, 10/23/18


Yskonyn

Quote from: Yskonyn on June 30, 2018, 12:39:55 AM
How do you guys do this at runtime then? Clearly you know something I do not.
And how do you guys lay down suppressive fire by AI?
"Pilots do not get paid for what they do daily, but they get paid for what they are capable of doing.
However, if pilots would need to do daily what they are capable of doing, nobody would dare to fly anymore."

Jarhead0331

^I'm not really sure what you are complaining about, or asking. I don't make complex missions, so if you're asking a scripting question, I don't have the knowledge to answer. I just look for missions that sound good in the workshop and play. I've got over 200 hours in ARMA playing scenarios and campaigns, many more if you count screwing around in the editor.

ARMA 3 isn't perfect. No AI is ever going to give the player a truly authentic experience. Personally, I have a lot of fun playing ARMA in single player scenarios. In fact, its the only way I play. Sometimes, a carefully planned and scripted mission comes off as feeling pretty authentic...sometimes they don't. Sometimes throwing two forces against each other in a quickly edited missions works too.

I guess i understand why somewhat wonky AI bothers people, but what I do not understand is why this game takes any criticism at all really. There is NOTHING else out there like it. Not before and not since. Nothing does a military sandbox with the same breadth and flexibility...nothing. ARMA 3, in my opinion, is a crowning achievement and it doesn't seem to get the credit it deserves, although there do seem to be over 3,000,000 people playing it.
Grogheads Uber Alles
Semper Grog
"No beast is more alpha than JH." Gusington, 10/23/18


Yskonyn

I am not complaining at all. Its a pretty simple question, no?
- How do you go about making your AI buddies lay down suppressive fire or create a base of fire to launch an assault from?

My dudes always keep on fiddling about, changing position, moving back and forth between cover in the area and often get shot up in the process.
I want them to stay put and lay down lead, but I don't know how.

So instead of complaining about my non-existent complaining you should assist a fellow battlebrother asking how to do something! :D
If you are having your period, fine, I'll ask again in a week or so, grumpypants. 👍🏻
"Pilots do not get paid for what they do daily, but they get paid for what they are capable of doing.
However, if pilots would need to do daily what they are capable of doing, nobody would dare to fly anymore."

Jarhead0331

#339
Quote from: Yskonyn on July 09, 2018, 03:50:54 AM
I am not complaining at all. Its a pretty simple question, no?
- How do you go about making your AI buddies lay down suppressive fire or create a base of fire to launch an assault from?

My dudes always keep on fiddling about, changing position, moving back and forth between cover in the area and often get shot up in the process.
I want them to stay put and lay down lead, but I don't know how.

So instead of complaining about my non-existent complaining you should assist a fellow battlebrother asking how to do something! :D
If you are having your period, fine, I'll ask again in a week or so, grumpypants. 👍🏻

I wasn't being grumpy. I really didn't understand what you were asking. We were talking about influencing AI behavior through scripting, so I think it was reasonable for me to conclude that is what you were asking about, no? With respect to gameplay, the  question was about very basic gameplay so I thought I might be missing something. Sorry, but I think you're being overly sensitive, dude.

Try ordering your squad to "stop" if you don't want them adjusting their position when you move. Try ordering your squad to change their mode to "combat" if you want want them to react to danger more realistically. Try ordering your squad to "attack" a specific target if you want them to direct fire at a particular enemy or objective. I wouldn't say you have to "baby" them, but you do have to give them basic orders periodically if you want them to behave in a certain way. I periodically make adjustments to their formation, positioning and posture.

It's questionable whether enemy AI will actually act "suppressed" but like I said, nothing is perfect. ARMA 3 does have suppression effect behavior built in, but their are mods out there that enhance the effect.

Sorry you got butt hurt over nothing.  :'(
Grogheads Uber Alles
Semper Grog
"No beast is more alpha than JH." Gusington, 10/23/18


Yskonyn

#340
So this is the part where I should say thank you?
Damn man, you are definately in touch with you feminine side at the moment.
Not sure what I did wrong here to warrant such a response from you. Whatever.  ???

I don't understand where it comes from you think I am butthurt or being oversensitive? The smileys were there to indicate humour.
Perhaps I am now misunderstanding.
"Pilots do not get paid for what they do daily, but they get paid for what they are capable of doing.
However, if pilots would need to do daily what they are capable of doing, nobody would dare to fly anymore."

Jarhead0331

I'm just going to ignore the back and forth.

Check this keyboard chart out. It's probably dated, but still lists the most common commands. You can see that there is enough there to give you a good amount of control over your team.

https://goo.gl/images/wJLjYk

I suppose the trouble with playing with the AI is the reason many people prefer MP. I'm almost exclusively a SP guy though. Must have something to do with me being anti-social, since I'm on my period.

Grogheads Uber Alles
Semper Grog
"No beast is more alpha than JH." Gusington, 10/23/18


Jarhead0331

You might also want to read through the field manual in game. It's become pretty detailed over the years and covers a wide range of topics.

The field manual is accessed from the main menu screen after loading the game.
Grogheads Uber Alles
Semper Grog
"No beast is more alpha than JH." Gusington, 10/23/18


Yskonyn

Quote from: Jarhead0331 on July 09, 2018, 07:09:36 AM
Must have something to do with me being anti-social, since I'm on my period.

😂 That made my day, lol!
Let's just drop it indeed.

Thanks for the pointers, so just to clarify, you don't use any mods for AI control at all? Everything with the stock commands?

If so then that's what I meant earlier with "you probably know something I don't", because I get quite frustrated with my AI buddies.
But if you get acceptable results that'll tell me to just practise more.

"Pilots do not get paid for what they do daily, but they get paid for what they are capable of doing.
However, if pilots would need to do daily what they are capable of doing, nobody would dare to fly anymore."

Jarhead0331

#344
Quote from: Yskonyn on July 09, 2018, 07:22:58 AM
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on July 09, 2018, 07:09:36 AM
Must have something to do with me being anti-social, since I'm on my period.

😂 That made my day, lol!
Let's just drop it indeed.

Thanks for the pointers, so just to clarify, you don't use any mods for AI control at all? Everything with the stock commands?

If so then that's what I meant earlier with "you probably know something I don't", because I get quite frustrated with my AI buddies.
But if you get acceptable results that'll tell me to just practise more.

I'm trying to think whether I have any mods that impact the basic AI behaviors. It's possible that some of the more comprehensive overhaul mods make certain changes, but I'm not totally sure. I will look. I'm pretty sure, though, that I don't have any mods that are dedicated to changing AI behaviors. I'm sure they are out there though...for instance, I know there is a "suppression" mod...since we are on that topic.

Friendly AI is a mixed bag for me, but overall, i find that it's very serviceable. They are far better at spotting enemies than I am, for instance, so I'm thankful for that. Their ability to identify and react to danger is where they are most useful. I keep them near me and unless, I'm trying to avoid detection, I keep them in a weapons free posture. When they start engaging, I know where to look.  However, if you want to get more out of them, it is important to take closer control and tell them what you want them to do, where to go and how "aware" of danger, or reactive, you want them to be.  Also, if there is a particular threat you want them to engage, it's useful to select the squad or a particular individual and give direct orders. For instance, when you want to target a tank, select your AT guy and direct his fire. It works!
Grogheads Uber Alles
Semper Grog
"No beast is more alpha than JH." Gusington, 10/23/18