Loose Lips Did Sink Ships!

Started by Nefaro, June 26, 2017, 02:28:34 PM

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Nefaro

I mentioned the case of congressman May's infamous WW2 idiocy to JP a couple days ago.

Couldn't recall the fine details, but here they are now:


http://www.ww2pacific.com/congmay.html


QuoteCongressman Credited with Sinking up to Ten Submarines

Ref: Congressional Indiscretion "Sinks Ships"

During WW2, Congressman Andrew May is credited   
with sinking ten U.S. submarines.

Visiting Pearl Harbor, he was briefed that the
Japanese had no idea how deep our submarines
could go and set their depth charges too shallow.
He reported this interesting fact in a press
gathering on his return home which was duly printed.
Of course, the Japanese picked up this fact and
reset their depth charges.

A loss of 800 men to other men's ego.




Citations:
1. "Senseless Secrets" - LtCol (ret) Michael Lee Lanning. Pg 82

"That intelligence failure involved U.S. Congressman Andrew Jackson May, who as a member of the House Military Affairs Committee visited the Pacific theater, where he received many intelligence and operational briefings. On his return, May held a press conference and stated that American submarines had a high survivability because Japanese depth charges were fused to explode at too shallow a depth. Soon enemy depth charges were rearmed to explode at a more effective depth of 250 feet. Vice Admiral Charles A. Lockwood, commander of the U.S. submarine fleet in the Pacific, later estimated that May's revelation cost the navy as many as ten submarines and 800 crewmen."


2. "Silent Victory" - Clay Blair. Vol.1 pg 397

"A serious breach of security may have helped the Japanese anti-submarine forces. In June 1943, Congressman Andrew Jackson May, a sixty-eight-year-old member of the House Military Affairs Committee returning from a war zone junket, gave a press interview during which he said, in effect, Don't worry about our submariners; the Japanese are setting their depth charges too shallow. Incredibly, the press associations sent this story over their wires, and many newspapers, including one in Honolulu, thoughtlessly published it.

"Lockwood and his staff were appalled--and furious--at this stupid revelation. Lockwood wrote Admiral Edwards in acid words, "I hear ... Congressman May ... said the Jap depth charges ... are not set deep enough. ... He would be pleased to know the Japs set'em deeper now." And after the war, Lockwood wrote, 'I consider that indiscretion cost us ten submarines and 800 officers and men.'"


......

Character Counts - bio of Congressman Andrew May.

    . . . elected as a Democrat to the Seventy-second and to the seven succeeding Congresses (March 4, 1931-January 3, 1947); chairman, Committee on Military Affairs (Seventy-sixth through Seventy-ninth Congresses); unsuccessful candidate for reelection in 1946 to the Eightieth Congress; convicted on July 3, 1947, on charges of accepting bribes for his influence in the award of munitions contracts during the Second World War; served nine months in prison during 1950 and received a full pardon from President Truman in 1952. . . .

mirth

An idiot and a war profiteer, charming.
"45 minutes of pooping Tribbles being juggled by a drunken Horta would be better than Season 1 of TNG." - SirAndrewD

"you don't look at the mantelpiece when you're poking the fire" - Bawb

"Can't 'un' until you 'pre', son." - Gus

Nefaro

I only first learned of this dumbassery from people on the Subsim forums about 11 or 12 years ago.  Was shocked at the idiocy.   :uglystupid2:

Makes me wonder how many other politicians did such a thing.

The Wiki Article:


QuoteThe May Incident

Historian Clay Blair claimed that May was responsible for a major release of highly confidential military information during World War II, known as the May Incident.[3] In that incident, U.S. submarines had been conducting a successful undersea war against Japanese shipping during World War II, frequently escaping Japanese anti-submarine depth charge attacks.[3][4] However, the deficiencies of Japanese depth-charge tactics were revealed in a press conference held in June 1943 by Congressman May on his return from a war zone junket.[3][4] At this press conference, May revealed the highly sensitive fact that American submarines had a high survival rate because Japanese depth charges were typically fuzed to explode at too shallow a depth.[3][4] Various press associations sent this leaked news story over their wires and many newspapers (including one in Honolulu, Hawaii), published it.[3][4]

It was subsequently discovered that Japanese naval antisubmarine forces were adjusting their depth charges to explode at a deeper depth.[3][4] Vice Admiral Charles A. Lockwood, commander of the U.S. submarine fleet in the Pacific, later estimated that May's security breach cost the United States Navy as many as ten submarines and 800 crewmen killed in action,[3][4] stating "I hear Congressman May said the (Japanese) depth charges are not set deep enough. He would be pleased to know (they) set them deeper now."[3][4] A report from the U.S. Navy's Pacific Submarine Fleet determined that Japanese anti-submarine warfare (ASW) forces failed to uncover the maximum test depth ability of U.S. fleet submarines during the war.[5] However, the report made no finding as to whether Japanese ASW forces altered their depth charge attacks to deeper settings as a consequence of May's revelation to the press.[5]


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_J._May

mirth

Nice of Truman to pardon him in '52.  :uglystupid2:
"45 minutes of pooping Tribbles being juggled by a drunken Horta would be better than Season 1 of TNG." - SirAndrewD

"you don't look at the mantelpiece when you're poking the fire" - Bawb

"Can't 'un' until you 'pre', son." - Gus

Nefaro

Quote from: mirth on June 26, 2017, 02:36:21 PM
Nice of Truman to pardon him in '52.  :uglystupid2:

Same party.  You know how it is when a president's term is over & all the pardons.  ::)


Politicians + cronyism.  Proceeded as usual, I see.

BanzaiCat

Not just May's idiocy, but the dumbasses in the press publishing those stories, too.

mirth

Quote from: BC on June 26, 2017, 02:37:58 PM
Not just May's idiocy, but the dumbasses in the press publishing those stories, too.

I was thinking the same thing. Pretty shameful.
"45 minutes of pooping Tribbles being juggled by a drunken Horta would be better than Season 1 of TNG." - SirAndrewD

"you don't look at the mantelpiece when you're poking the fire" - Bawb

"Can't 'un' until you 'pre', son." - Gus

Nefaro

Quote from: BC on June 26, 2017, 02:37:58 PM
Not just May's idiocy, but the dumbasses in the press publishing those stories, too.


Yeah.  You'd think someone along that chain would've questioned whether posting such info would be a good idea.  Naaa. 

JasonPratt

I have to admit, I'd have been tempted to "leak" counter-intelligence to troll the enemy. "Japanese destroyer operators are inept, fortunately; they'd have killed four times as many of our boats, easily, but the timers on their charges are poor, so they take too long to fire and they keep setting them too deep. So the charges explode too late and in the wrong place! It's kind of hilarious really. They shouldn't be allowed near 20th century technology."

Result: some captains start setting the charges too shallow and to detonate too quickly. With any luck, taking a destroyer or two down in the process.

>:D
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