DCS Discussion

[Jarhead0331]

I expect to have my office/man cave/flex room/etc. finally finished with the renovation sometime week after next, which means I can set up my Obutto gaming rig and break out the HOTAS. 

I'm thinking this is the time to invest in some DCS.  I think I'm going to go with the F-14, F-5, and the Persian Gulf and Nevada maps. 

I know it's crazy I'm not getting the F/A-18....oh who am I kidding.  I'll probably get that, too. 

I believe that will set me up with plenty of things to do for the rest of the summer!

I just cannot get comfortable with the tomcat. I enjoy cold start, general flight and some of the other basic systems, but for combat I feel like it just can't compete with the 4th generation aircraft. Constantly taking my eyes off the hud to check basic numbers like airspeed and altitude is really bizarre. Also, no UFC has me constantly looking down to the left and right consoles to enter basic info. and access key systems like the radios, autopilot, etc. No DDIs, or MFDs to top it all off. I love how it looks, I love what they've done with jester, but I just can't shake the feeling that it is a big step down in capability from the Hornet.

I'd be interested in getting your take on the latest version of BMS...4.34. It's added a lot of fidelity to the communications system and more realism across the board.

[Toonces]

I don't know why I didn't do this sooner, but today I installed DCS World and Combined Arms on my laptop.  I've barely scratched the surface of CA since I bought it, and I'm not sure why because it seems to be just the right level of complexity that I prefer in my ground combat simulators.

Are any of you guys playing CA?  It seems like it would be pretty fun to get a GH group online and blow each other up.

[mikeck]

Well, in fairness, the F-14 was one of the first (if not first) generation 4 fighters. In fact, it's really more of a generation 3.5 in some ways (lacks high maneuverability)

[Skoop]

I expect to have my office/man cave/flex room/etc. finally finished with the renovation sometime week after next, which means I can set up my Obutto gaming rig and break out the HOTAS. 

I'm thinking this is the time to invest in some DCS.  I think I'm going to go with the F-14, F-5, and the Persian Gulf and Nevada maps. 

I know it's crazy I'm not getting the F/A-18....oh who am I kidding.  I'll probably get that, too. 

I believe that will set me up with plenty of things to do for the rest of the summer!

I just cannot get comfortable with the tomcat. I enjoy cold start, general flight and some of the other basic systems, but for combat I feel like it just can't compete with the 4th generation aircraft. Constantly taking my eyes off the hud to check basic numbers like airspeed and altitude is really bizarre. Also, no UFC has me constantly looking down to the left and right consoles to enter basic info. and access key systems like the radios, autopilot, etc. No DDIs, or MFDs to top it all off. I love how it looks, I love what they've done with jester, but I just can't shake the feeling that it is a big step down in capability from the Hornet.

I'd be interested in getting your take on the latest version of BMS...4.34. It's added a lot of fidelity to the communications system and more realism across the board.

You do realize that the tomcat is able to simultaneously track and put 6 pheonix missles down range beyond 50 mm all at once.  This makes it the most dangerous plane in the game and has a huge advantage over the hornet because it can engage long before the hornet can even think about engaging.  It's such a lethal system I'm surprised it wasn't continued, everything gave way to stealth tech.  The hornet drivers have to dodge and notch and pray you miss 6 times with your pheonixs so that they can get closer so they can get a pitbull 120c on you.

The hornet has the advantage close in with the high aspect sidewinders launched from the helmet mounted sight.

[Jarhead0331]

Well, in fairness, the F-14 was one of the first (if not first) generation 4 fighters. In fact, it's really more of a generation 3.5 in some ways (lacks high maneuverability)

I see it's on at least one list as "the world's first" 4th generation fighter, but in my opinion, The F14A and B that you are flying in DCS is most definitely NOT a true 4th generation fighter. You might be able to make a stronger argument that the D is one (or maybe even the B+), but you'll never fly that in this game unless there is a miracle (and I'm praying!).

The F14 has precisely the type of limitations that the design philosophy driving the 4th generation of fighter aircraft was meant to redress...over-reliance on BVR combat, relative poor maneuverability, one role specialist as an interceptor, no fly by wire FLCS, all analog avionics with no digital computers, etc.

Regardless of generation, my dislike of flying the aircraft in DCS is based pretty much only on its less advanced Cold War avionics. This is the crux of the issue for me.

[Jarhead0331]

I expect to have my office/man cave/flex room/etc. finally finished with the renovation sometime week after next, which means I can set up my Obutto gaming rig and break out the HOTAS. 

I'm thinking this is the time to invest in some DCS.  I think I'm going to go with the F-14, F-5, and the Persian Gulf and Nevada maps. 

I know it's crazy I'm not getting the F/A-18....oh who am I kidding.  I'll probably get that, too. 

I believe that will set me up with plenty of things to do for the rest of the summer!

I just cannot get comfortable with the tomcat. I enjoy cold start, general flight and some of the other basic systems, but for combat I feel like it just can't compete with the 4th generation aircraft. Constantly taking my eyes off the hud to check basic numbers like airspeed and altitude is really bizarre. Also, no UFC has me constantly looking down to the left and right consoles to enter basic info. and access key systems like the radios, autopilot, etc. No DDIs, or MFDs to top it all off. I love how it looks, I love what they've done with jester, but I just can't shake the feeling that it is a big step down in capability from the Hornet.

I'd be interested in getting your take on the latest version of BMS...4.34. It's added a lot of fidelity to the communications system and more realism across the board.

You do realize that the tomcat is able to simultaneously track and put 6 pheonix missles down range beyond 50 mm all at once.  This makes it the most dangerous plane in the game and has a huge advantage over the hornet because it can engage long before the hornet can even think about engaging.  It's such a lethal system I'm surprised it wasn't continued, everything gave way to stealth tech.  The hornet drivers have to dodge and notch and pray you miss 6 times with your pheonixs so that they can get closer so they can get a pitbull 120c on you.

The hornet has the advantage close in with the high aspect sidewinders launched from the helmet mounted sight.

Great. The F14 has a single system that in 1990 was more capable than the F18. Otherwise, the Hornet is more capable in every single way.

My intention is not to start a pissing match over which is the better fighter because God knows I've loved the F14.  It was my dream aircraft throughout the 1980s and 90s.  However, as far as DCS goes,  I guess if all you want to do is fly and engage multiple targets at long range, the F14 is the plane for you. If you want to do virtually anything else, you'll probably get more mileage and enjoyment out of the Hornet. This is my personal preference.

[mikeck]

Well, in fairness, the F-14 was one of the first (if not first) generation 4 fighters. In fact, it's really more of a generation 3.5 in some ways (lacks high maneuverability)

I see it's on at least one list as "the world's first" 4th generation fighter, but in my opinion, The F14A and B that you are flying in DCS is most definitely NOT a true 4th generation fighter. You might be able to make a stronger argument that the D is one (or maybe even the B+), but you'll never fly that in this game unless there is a miracle (and I'm praying!).

The F14 has precisely the type of limitations that the design philosophy driving the 4th generation of fighter aircraft was meant to redress...over-reliance on BVR combat, relative poor maneuverability, one role specialist as an interceptor, no fly by wire FLCS, all analog avionics with no digital computers, etc.

Regardless of generation, my dislike of flying the aircraft in DCS is based pretty much only on its less advanced Cold War avionics. This is the crux of the issue for me.

Jh, I don't disagree. That's why I added:
" In fact, it's really more of a generation 3.5 in some ways (lacks high maneuverability"

I think it has more in common with the F-4 Phantom than it does with an F-18 hornet. Yes it's radar allows engagement of 6 targets simultaneously but the definition of a fourth generation was a large increase in maneuverability and a true look-down/shoot-down radar like the F-15 allowing for true combat between fighters as opposed to interception of high flying bombers. Keeping in mind that the F-14 was designed to do that generation 3 task: intercepting bombers

F-14D is a great aircraft...insanely capable in a BVR fight and good in a WVR fight. But the A was underpowered and the ability to engage 6 aircraft at the same time- while revolutionary- doesn't Make it as Capable As the F-18. If it was, The Navy would be flying F-14Es instead of  F/A-18e

So I think you're right that the capabilities of the Fa-18c exceed that of the F-14a, but I guess we enjoy what we are good at. If I could fly the f*** out of an f-14, I guess that's what I'd do

[DoctorQuest]

Aw, hell. Now I really want BOTH of them......

[Jarhead0331]

Aw, hell. Now I really want BOTH of them......

At a bare minimum, you should definitely get the Hornet now...its 25% off for the DCS summer sale. The Tomcat is not presently discounted.

[mikeck]

If nothing else, the F-18 is a great platform for Air to Air AND Air to Ground. That way, you aren't limited to one or the other like you are with the F-14, F-15, A-10, Mirage, etc (some have limited ATG or ATA but the hornet Excels at both)

I've never flown the F-18 but I will tell you the Av-8 is a blast if you enjoy low level valley-flying ground. Attack

[DoctorQuest]

Aw, hell. Now I really want BOTH of them......

At a bare minimum, you should definitely get the Hornet now...its 25% off for the DCS summer sale. The Tomcat is not presently discounted.

Good advice.

[mikeck]

Ok...I need some help/recommendation. I play SP only. What I'm interested in doing is setting up a land battle in which I would take part of in my Harrier offering CAS. I don't want to just have vehicles close to eachother on the map; I'd like them to be engaging in organized combat for which my CAS would be meaningful and would have an effect on the battle

So, do I need "combined arms 1.5"? Or is the base "DCS for steam" and its mission editor?

[Jarhead0331]

You shouldn't need combined arms to simply create a mission like that in the editor, as far as I know. However, you won't be able to give orders to ground units AFTER the battle begins without Combined Arms. In battle, CA gives the player access to a strategic command map where you can give orders, plan support missions, maneuvers, attacks, etc. just like in a strategy game. You can also take command of individual ground units in 1st person.

[Grim.Reaper]

You shouldn't need combined arms to simply create a mission like that in the editor, as far as I know. However, you won't be able to give orders to ground units AFTER the battle begins without Combined Arms. In battle, CA gives the player access to a strategic command map where you can give orders, plan support missions, maneuvers, attacks, etc. just like in a strategy game. You can also take command of individual ground units in 1st person.

JH, just curious....do you think combined arms is worth a purchase?  Just about very review I have seen in various places indicate not worth the price (even on sale), limited, and buggy.  With the sale going on, I was considering it but haven't really seen anywhere that really sold me on it yet.  I only do single player so not sure if that makes a difference as well.

[Jarhead0331]

I have it, but have never used it at length. I think Toonces went through a stretch where he was digging it. Hopefully, he will chime in.