Germany lifts HARD ban on swastikas in games? Good or bad idea?

Started by Destraex, August 11, 2018, 04:03:11 AM

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Gusington

Meh. Is anyone ready to be an adult about anything these days? Personally this is not a big deal, to me.


слава Україна!

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Philippe

I never really liked making swastika mods, so maybe now I won't have to anymore.  I don't like having to explain to my girlfriend that I'm obsessed with historical accuracy and that it's just a mod.
Every generation gets the Greeks and Romans it deserves.


History is a bad joke played by the living on the dead.


Senility is no excuse for feeblemindedness.

jamus34

Personally I'm all for it. You'll get the assclowns that will try to use / re-adopt / manipulate this but the history needs to be remembered

In the US they are trying to erase all reminders of the Confederacy which I also feel is wrong.

History is history, it should not be erased or retconned but remember, both the good and the ugly.
Insert witty comment here.

Micha

Dhingis khan killed 30 Million People sometime on cruler way than the nazis. There is an german pop song "Dhing, dhing, dhingiskahn..." Evryone sing and dance to it. Hitler did not kill much more but only showing a sewastika is forbidden. German stupidi ! When a sewastika is forbidden the german song must be also forbidden.

stolypin

I'm 58 years old, have 2 college degrees, and own over 500 books about the Third Reich and Germany military in World War Two. 

What exactly is being accomplished by preventing me from seeing a swastika in a computer game (which I will immediately sidestep by installing a mod)?

Staggerwing

It might fill you with an overwhelming desire to annex the Sudetenland, or maybe even that strip of grass between you and your neighbor's driveway.
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em2nought

Just making room for the confederate flag ban that's coming.   ::) Two bans would be too confusing.  :knuppel2:
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Toonces

Quote from: stolypin on August 11, 2018, 09:26:29 AM
... own over 500 books about the Third Reich and Germany military in World War Two. 



I think it's fine.

Also, I'd really like to come visit your library and share some beers!   :smitten:
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Dammit Carl!

Quote from: jamus34 on August 11, 2018, 09:02:32 AM
History is history, it should not be erased or retconned but remember, both the good and the ugly.

My thoughts exactly.

bbmike

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airboy

I find it difficult to believe the Germans did this.  They have been so dogmatic about the issue.  I understand the ban perhaps as long as the 1970s, but about everyone involved in WW2 is now dead.

This has never been a big issue for me and I've never used the mods to adjust the flags.  But I also always thought it was pretty dumb.

Jarhead0331

Quote from: Micha on August 11, 2018, 09:14:05 AM
Dhingis khan killed 30 Million People sometime on cruler way than the nazis. There is an german pop song "Dhing, dhing, dhingiskahn..." Evryone sing and dance to it. Hitler did not kill much more but only showing a sewastika is forbidden. German stupidi ! When a sewastika is forbidden the german song must be also forbidden.

Let's not trivialize the depth of Nazi cruelty by comparing it to other murderous empires. Germany was the first nation in human history to industrialize genocide and implement a systemic legal scheme of butchering people based on their religion or ethnicity. For that, the German atrocities of 20th century are unique and should never be forgotten. Your attitude, inadvertent or not, is the whole reason why a ban on this imagery was deemed logical in the first place...because these crimes become whitewashed, or otherwise mitigated through the passage of time.

In any event, I agree that the ban does not serve any purpose really, but it is critical that we don't throw away common sense too. 
Grogheads Uber Alles
Semper Grog
"No beast is more alpha than JH." Gusington, 10/23/18


stolypin

Quote from: Jarhead0331 on August 11, 2018, 11:12:05 AM
Quote from: Micha on August 11, 2018, 09:14:05 AM
Dhingis khan killed 30 Million People sometime on cruler way than the nazis. There is an german pop song "Dhing, dhing, dhingiskahn..." Evryone sing and dance to it. Hitler did not kill much more but only showing a sewastika is forbidden. German stupidi ! When a sewastika is forbidden the german song must be also forbidden.

Let's not trivialize the depth of Nazi cruelty by comparing it to other murderous empires. Germany was the first nation in human history to industrialize genocide and implement a systemic legal scheme of butchering people based on their religion or ethnicity. For that, the German atrocities of 20th century are unique and should never be forgotten. Your attitude, inadvertent or not, is the whole reason why a ban on this imagery was deemed logical in the first place...because these crimes become whitewashed, or otherwise mitigated through the passage of time.

In any event, I agree that the ban does not serve any purpose really, but it is critical that we don't throw away common sense too.

In his 2,400 page "Gulag Archipelago", Alexandr Solzhenitsyn (winner of the Nobel Peace Prize for Literature), clearly demonstrates that the Soviet Union began a "systematic legal scheme of butchering people based on their religion or ethnicity" as early as 1918.  In fact, one of Lenin's earliest decrees was on the establishment of concentration camps -- through which tens of millions would pass (or perish) over the next 40 years.

Yet I have lots of games that freely display the hammer and sickle with no mod needed.

As Solzhenitsyn comments bitterly:  "Hitler's camps made him famous.  No one cares about ours at all."





Jarhead0331

Quote from: stolypin on August 11, 2018, 12:38:05 PM
Quote from: Jarhead0331 on August 11, 2018, 11:12:05 AM
Quote from: Micha on August 11, 2018, 09:14:05 AM
Dhingis khan killed 30 Million People sometime on cruler way than the nazis. There is an german pop song "Dhing, dhing, dhingiskahn..." Evryone sing and dance to it. Hitler did not kill much more but only showing a sewastika is forbidden. German stupidi ! When a sewastika is forbidden the german song must be also forbidden.

Let's not trivialize the depth of Nazi cruelty by comparing it to other murderous empires. Germany was the first nation in human history to industrialize genocide and implement a systemic legal scheme of butchering people based on their religion or ethnicity. For that, the German atrocities of 20th century are unique and should never be forgotten. Your attitude, inadvertent or not, is the whole reason why a ban on this imagery was deemed logical in the first place...because these crimes become whitewashed, or otherwise mitigated through the passage of time.

In any event, I agree that the ban does not serve any purpose really, but it is critical that we don't throw away common sense too.

In his 2,400 page "Gulag Archipelago", Alexandr Solzhenitsyn (winner of the Nobel Peace Prize for Literature), clearly demonstrates that the Soviet Union began a "systematic legal scheme of butchering people based on their religion or ethnicity" as early as 1918.  In fact, one of Lenin's earliest decrees was on the establishment of concentration camps -- through which tens of millions would pass (or perish) over the next 40 years.

Yet I have lots of games that freely display the hammer and sickle with no mod needed.

As Solzhenitsyn comments bitterly:  "Hitler's camps made him famous.  No one cares about ours at all."

As someone who admittedly possesses "500 books about the Third Reich and Germany (sic) military in World War Two" in his personal library, I'm not surprised that my point would cruise above your head. Thanks for making my point even clearer though.  :clap: I'm not sure why some feel the need to argue moral equivalences in order to somehow try to defend the indefensible.  :uglystupid2:
Grogheads Uber Alles
Semper Grog
"No beast is more alpha than JH." Gusington, 10/23/18